Horsegirl have a sincere apology: They’re not going to read this article. It’s band code.

“My parents used to send me links to every bit of press we got,” vocalist/bassist Penelope Lowenstein tells me. “I had to be like, ‘It’s really sweet that you guys are excited about this, but I don’t read this, and I would love it if you didn’t send it to me, actually.’ Then something big will happen, and they’ll be like, ‘I know we’re not supposed to say anything about press, but…’”

Something big is about to happen to Horsegirl. They’ll soon release their sophomore album Phonetics On And On, out this Friday. Recorded with indie-pop experimentalist Cate Le Bon at the storied Loft studio in Chicago, it’s also their second for legendary indie label Matador. But the accomplished members of Horsegirl can’t stay out too late tonight: Lowenstein and co-vocalist/guitarist Nora Cheng, both English majors at NYU, have class in the morning. Afterwards, they’re flying to Los Angeles with drummer Gigi Reece to play a show.

When Horsegirl broke out in 2022 with their debut LP Versions Of Modern Performance, most press contextualized their ‘90s-inspired indie rock at odds with their young age; Lowenstein was still in high school at the time. Modern Performance drew comparisons to Stephen Malkmus’ lackadaisical melodies and Kevin Shields’ screeching guitar lines, contrasted with Lowenstein and Cheng’s girlish vocals.

Girlhood, as Horsegirl explain to me over dinner in Williamsburg, was a big reference point for Phonetics On And On. It was a source of comfort at the time for the band, who each moved from their Chicago hometown to New York in between albums. Phonetics lead single “2468” strips away the noise down to the building blocks of indie rock, layering playground chants over pared-down guitar, bass, drums, and a crooning violin. It’s decidedly a more minimal approach, but their hooks, cheeky humor, and knack for composition haven’t waned.

Horsegirl worked with Le Bon on Matador’s recommendation; immediately upon getting acquainted with her, the band felt a strong sense of connection and trust. “All it took was meeting her for the first time to realize she’s, like, kind of one of us,” Lowenstein says with a smile. “I feel like she saw us the way we wanted to be seen. And considering how much we’ve admired her, her kind of weirdo approval meant a lot to us.”

Below, Horsegirl discuss more influences that went into the making of Phonetics On And On.

Children’s Recitals

LOWENSTEIN: We had an image in mind of, like, a janky auditorium: The kid band shows up, no one has a pedal board, the guitar just goes straight into the amp. Talent show vibes with only the gear that the school has. That image was an aesthetic we wanted to channel.

REECE: As young adults who became friends when we were teenagers, we talked about girlhood a lot while making this record together. I think a childhood recital taps into those feelings of it being really playful and scrappy, and it doesn’t really sound right, but you’re just happy to be doing it.

I feel like when your last album came out, a lot of the press surrounding it said something like, “The music is fantastic, but also, they’re so young!” So it’s interesting that you amped that up for this album.

REECE: I feel like we exited a juvenile stage that we were in. But we reflect on that time with a lot of happiness, and it’s very sentimental.

LOWENSTEIN: This record is totally different from the teenage vibe of the first record. This is more about the joy of kids’ art, and that innocence that can be really hard to replicate as an adult, but you wish that you were able to tap into it.

I remember when I was a kid doing piano recitals, it always felt super exciting, though the stakes are actually pretty low. It’s an interesting dichotomy.

REECE: I have memories of being in concert band in school, and being, like, one kid out of 50 — I’m up there shaking, but it feels so good to get through a song. We all sat here, we all practiced it, and it all sounds a bit messy because we’re kids.

LOWENSTEIN: And the messiness is the most charming thing.

REECE: Exactly. The messiness is the coolest part. So I think even though we’re growing a bit, we still want to channel that rawness. Releasing our inhibitions a little.

Do you have any specific memories of doing recitals yourselves?

LOWENSTEIN: Nora and I did Girls Rock together. We must’ve been 15, and Nora texted me one day saying she found the Bandcamp link with all the Girls Rock songs. I was going through it and found the song that I was on. It’s the most ridiculous thing ever, but it’s still so cool. It sounds like the Raincoats or something.

CHENG: Yeah, there’s no concern for guitar tone. In that program, you learn how to play your instrument in one week, and then you write the song at the end of the week and record it. So, you’re kind of doing all you’re able to do on those songs. I think we were also interested in how limits like that can help you create something you wouldn’t have done otherwise.

REECE: And something that an adult with all the skill and knowledge literally might not think of.

Gigi, you mentioned being in concert band. What did you play?

REECE: Saxophone. There were only two girl saxophonists, and nine boys.

LOWENSTEIN: Wow, I didn’t know saxophone sections were such a sausage party.

REECE: I was always told I was one of the worst when I literally was not. Misogyny, straight up. But yeah, I still loved concert band. I would give myself goosebumps all the time. For me, it wasn’t even about being on stage, but in a room full of kids who are all somehow playing their instruments to the tune of this sheet music we can all somehow read. It’s magical. Like, man, this is the stuff of life.

Working with Cate Le Bon, how did you convey this is what you wanted the album to sound like?

LOWENSTEIN: There’s a good Cate quote from our time in the studio. She was like, “You guys don’t have to put on this jankiness. You naturally have it. You can try to be sophisticated, but anything the three of you do will always be janky.” I think people who know us — not just people we work with, but our friend group too — can kind of see our process and understand that’s just how we are.

It can be hard to communicate, and it’s something that we’re still kind of learning to navigate. It’s really hard to pass off any creative stuff to other people for us. And sometimes I do feel like our weird vision gets lost in translation. The fact that sometimes we want to look awkward in things is hard to translate.

REECE: But with Cate, we didn’t really have to tell her anything.

Trios

CHENG: This record is more clean-sounding; you can hear each instrument really clearly. On the first record, it was more of like this muddled mass. So we were interested in really embracing the trio thing. You can hear that there are three people playing, rather than us trying to fill all this extra space.

LOWENSTEIN: Yeah. I think we realized there’s a really beautiful awkwardness and emptiness to three people playing together live on a stage. You go see a live show now, and the inclination is to make the set sound exactly like the record. It almost feels like people are, like, scared of what the band actually sounds like without all the extra stuff.

We toured the last album a lot, and then when we came back to try writing the new one, I think we all felt really excited about the natural emptiness that exists in our band and the kind of weird space that is created when there’s only one guitar. Like, when Nora finishes a riff or whatever, it just hangs there. Taking all these songs to the studio, that emptiness allowed us to flesh out the songs with arrangements that wouldn’t have worked if we were, like, making the noisiest guitar tones. We were able to add things like violin.

The Velvet Underground’s Loaded

REECE: I think Loaded, specifically, was the reference for how we wanted our album to be mastered. The way each song sounds on it — it’s just great.

LOWENSTEIN: Obviously, the Velvet Underground are a guiding light for, like, every indie rock band. But as teenagers, we were so into noisiness, and that was kind of the first way I ever connected with that band. And then I moved to New York and discovered Loaded – I weirdly wasn’t raised on the Velvet Underground. I’m gonna show them to my kids. But I think realizing that a band as experimental as them was also writing the most beautiful pop love songs, verse, chorus, verse kind of thing, gave me a sense of permission to do the same. Pop song structure was another thing we wanted to explore more on this record.

What other artists inspired the sound of this record?

REECE: We’ve been saying to everyone: Young Marble Giants. The way that their bass lines are melodic, and the guitar can get rhythmic.

LOWENSTEIN: Such a mood with so little. Those songs are so kooky and atmospheric, but there’s nothing going on. Also, those guys aren’t really a rock band in the way we are, so it’s a cool thing to try to take inspiration from. Television Personalities were also a big one for us. Cate was referencing them a lot.

Faust IV

CHENG: I think that album is cool because all the songs are different, but they all definitely exist in the same world. That’s something I’ve sort of thought about our band, too. It varies from song to song but the throughline is there.

LOWENSTEIN: Before we met Cate in person, we had a Zoom call with her. We knew that it was meant to be when she said, “To me, Faust IV is everything. It’s the perfect record.” It’s really freaky. Cate knew we were into krautrock, as many bands are, and I think Faust is a really good example of taking influence from krautrock beyond just the motorik drum beat everyone rips off. There’s a playfulness to them that’s so cool and interesting, and I think channeling that playfulness and repetition was a big guiding light for us: A cool rock song that’s also ridiculous. The tambourine is so loud.

REECE: I love that tambourine. I feel like I personally had to stop myself from trying to add tambourine to each song on this album. Also, the tambourine that they had at the Loft, where we recorded, was just the most perfect, shimmery, beautiful tambourine. And then we were told that Glenn [Kotche], the Wilco drummer, stole it from another studio or something, because he knew it was the best one! I was touched to be able to use the same tambourine Glenn uses.

Moving Away From Home

CHENG: Moving from Chicago to New York was the first time we’d ever lived alone, or not with our parents. You experience a lot of life really fast when you move out, no matter where you are. In our case, we grew up in one of the biggest cities in America and then moved to a bigger one. It’s shocking in a way you don’t even realize.

REECE: I got here and I was like, “I know what a city is about! I’m not worried!” But it was definitely different, especially while also going through the ages of 18 to 21.

LOWENSTEIN: There’s a bit of a lonely feeling on this record, and there’s such a loneliness to being in a new city. We had such a sense of community in Chicago, it was hard to make sense of moving and where we belong. But I think the feeling of doing that all together made our connection with each other feel much more familial.

What songs on the record feel most like New York to you?

REECE: For me, it’s “In Twos.” I listened to the demo we made in the New York winter a lot, before we recorded the album.

CHENG: I think “Rock City” gets to the loneliness aspect of growing up.

LOWENSTEIN: Probably “Frontrunner.” Nora and I live together, and I was having a really, really terrible day. My heart was broken. I came home and Nora and I wrote this song together. The version on the record is, like, exactly what was initially written. It just captures a snapshot of that apartment and a very 20-something experience.

REECE: I was asked to describe that song the other day. I said, “It was written at a time when Penelope and Nora needed each other.” Straight up. It’s how you guys connect, and that’s beautiful [All laugh].

Phonetics On And On is out 2/14 on Matador.